Как го правят големите ?

[Nikifena]

Как се прави радио лампа

[ruidolff]

Градски, мога да ти цитирам няколко прекрасни статии от сп."Българско радио" и от други списания и книги, в които мъдри люде писаха как се прави радиолампата, но мисля, че става дума за нещо друго. Би ли уточнил смисъла на темата, която така или иначе касае китарджийското братство? Никола Стефанов - Рудолф - Пловдив - LZ1NHS.

[Nikifena]

Градски, че и адаше, темата е ала how it's made, но свързана повече с нещата около музикантите. Смятам, че лампите са една част свързана от доста време с музиката и макар и това видео да не е най-доброто показно как се прави лампата, то от части показва принципа и процеса за създаване на една радиолампа.

 

поздрави

[vihro]

Малко информация за финиша на иснтрументите и по-специално за различните видове финиши при производството на барабани.Съжалявам,че е на ангийски,но се разбира лесно.

Wood finishing - Searches from DrumShed

 

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This is a compilation of Drum Shed searches on the subject of wood finishing. I did this for my own education, but now that it's done I thought I'd post it for others who may be looking for the same information.

I wish I had written down the name of each author to give them credit, but the idea didn't occur to me until it was too late. I do recall that rhjanes was prominent in many of the discussions. If anyone is offended by having their comments being reposted or if reposting is not proper ettiquette, please feel free to have the moderator delete this post.

I have grouped related comments together - this is not the order that they were originally posted in. Whenever someone different is speaking, there is a space between the comments - so you may hear opposite points of view one right after the other. I tried to include a lot of different ideas. I added a few notes to myself along the way to clarify things, and corrected some punctuation, but 99% of the content of this post is from the original authors.

When I originally tried to post this I got a message saying that it was too long. So, I'll have to post it in three entries.

 

 

SEQUENCE OF FINISHING STEPS:

 

Sand/prep

Dye or stain

Seal grain if desired

Top coat (lacquer, poly, oil)

Wax

 

 

DYEING:

 

One thing you may want to try that helps with dyeing is to wet the surface, wait about 15 minutes, then sand the hairs that rise up with 220 grit sandpaper. Don't sand any higher than that. That will open up the pores of the wood and raise the grain so your wood is more uniform and reduce the fuzzy grains that pop up.

 

The aniline dyes are recommended.

 

I just stained the inside of my snare black... here are a few tips from my experience:

First go buy some De-natured Alcohol and rub the drum with it. Don't be shy, use a lot of it and really rub it into the wood then let dry (takes about 10 mins b/c it evaporates quickly). The alcohol will actually open up the pores of the wood and allow it to soak up a lot more of the stain. I did this and got amazing results on my birch snare. Also, let the stain dry at least a day b/c black stain lightens up quite a bit after it compeletly dries... and yea, it will take many coats.

 

To tone down a color that is too vivid: Yes, you can mix colors (put one on top of another).

 

I use a lot of dyes on drums and yes, you can pretty much dilute dyes as much as you would like to come up with some great looking colors.

 

If you want a muted tone, try wiping a wet rag over the shell. The water will lift out some of the dye and lighten the color. be sure to dry the shell as you go so you don't just run the color.

 

 

AN OPTION TO STAINING:

 

Instead of staining the drum, you can put dye into lacquer and spray it. This is kind of like holding up a color transparency rather than trying to get the drum to accept stain. Example: http://forum.drumshed.org/showthread...t=blue+lacquer

 

 

TO FILL THE GRAIN:

 

Q: Anyone know if you put the sanding sealer on BEFORE you dye the shell or AFTER you dye the shell right before you start your first coat of polyurethane? I was told by someone you put it on before you apply the dye, but this doesnt sound right to me.

Also, is a sanding sealer necessary if you dye a shell? Or will the dye fill in the holes?

 

A: Sand smooth, then dye, then sealer. Dye doesn't fill anything, just colors. Sealer will help you get gloss and smooth faster, if that is the finish you are after.

 

A: I spray sealer first, before stain and/or urethane lacquer.

 

A: I usually use pore filler and squeegee first (before topcoat). It’s a lot cheaper and less time consuming than using $80 a quart top coat to do it with.

 

A: Topcoat and paints are just that. Not a filler. Hence, they make grain sealer, primer/surfacers etc.

TUNG OIL VS VARNISH VS LACQUER

 

100% pure tung never really dries and if it does its soft and wrinkled and takes months for it to do that. it will clearly state if its pure. (Note: The Tung at Home Depot is not 100% pure and I think it does dry.)

A "wiping varnish" which is any type of varnish including polyurethane varnish thinned enough with mineral spirts to be wipe on with a cloth. ie wipe on poly, Formby, Waterlox. it will dry over night.

Lacquer is 50 percent cured when it leaves the can.

A lacquer might actually be acrylic, polyurethane, urethane, enamel etc.

Laquer is nasty stuff! Easy to use, cheap, toxic, hard to dispose of etc. It also doesn't play well with hardly any other finishes.

 

 

OIL

 

The Arm-R-Seal is a much more durable and a protective finish than Watco Danish oil. Both great finishing products , the Watco is real thin and oily going on, but gives a nice hand rubbed luster look.

The Arm-R-Seal, an oil varnish mix, still oil , but more resins and a bit thicker than the Watco. More protection, and a bit more of a gloss to it when finished.

 

I believe the two products are both oil based (Watco danish oil and the Arm-R-Seal).

Here's what I would do, create a test piece the same way your drum is, including the buffing with 0000 steel wool, Then go ahead and give your Arm-R-Seal an application or 2. See what you come up with.

 

The other thing to try , would be to give 1-2 thin wipe on coats of Zinzeer "Seal Coat" then move onto your Arm-R-Seal. The "Seal Coat" is a dewaxed shellac and is designed to be applied over or under almost anything, oil or water based. It's used for many reasons. It could be used as a sealer,bond coat, finish coat(Although not the most durable).

 

ALL of the proucts mentioned(Watco danish oil,Arm-R-Seal, and the Zinzeer "Seal Coat") are great products. Easy to apply and give great results.

 

I use the Watco Danish oil and Waterlox (straight out of the can - beautiful) and love them both. Waterlox is very similar to the Arm-R-Seal, they are both an oil/varnish mix.

 

Many people recommend (Sam) Maloof's oil.

Many complaints about Formby's products being too runny.

 

A guy at a woodworking shop tells me that Danish oil is just a different combination of oils (including tung oil) varnish etc. to kind of speed up the process, that the term "danish" is really purely a marketing name.

Secondly, he says that the Formby & Minwax are also a tung oil with different types of additives, etc.

The consensus on this site seems to be in favor of the Minwax tung oil. I am leaning towards the Minwax tung (the stuff at Home Depot just says tung not satin or high gloss).

 

If you want a shiny and completely flat finish (very hard and time consuming!) use sanding sealer then the tung and wetsand, polish, wax. if you want low lustre with pores showing, go straight tung and some OOOO steel wool. For a low lustre perfectly flat: sanding sealer, tung, wetsand, steel wool.

 

You dont wet sand tung between coats. Keep applying coats of tung, just dip a cloth in it and rub it into the shell. I normally put on about 10 + applications - not quite coats because it doesn't build, the wood just soaks it up. Once you've got that, then hit it with some 0000 steel wool and buff it up nice. you can wax it after that if you want more gloss.

 

Yet another tung method:

0000 steel wool the drum

apply first "coat" of tung

wait one day

apply second "coat"

wait a day

etc.

after the 5th application 0000 steel wool the drum

I do about 5 more applications of the tung

at this point i will 0000 steel wool the drum

wait about a week

steel wool again (just to get out any dust etc.)

then buff it up with the electric buffer using paste wax.

 

And another tung method:

I barely sand tung. I get the shell prepped extremely smooth then apply very light coats, many many many (like 25) of them until there's a bit of a buildup. here's an example. I also oil up the edges and inside but not the same as the outside of the shell. this is a jtpco cherry, repete owns it and plays it a lot I hear tell.

 

Btw, there's no wax or polishing going on with this shell. It's all meticulously oiled to be extremely smooth. I seriously only sanded this maybe every 10th coat and that was just with 2000 grit very lightly and dry to knock off some of the very small bumps. At the very end I sanded again, then applied one very last coat rather than polishing it up. I can't stress this enough

 

Don't use sealer on an oil finish. the oil can't get through the sealer. Sealer is basically lacquer. You use sealer before lacquer in order to minimize the number of coats of clear it takes to get enough on there. Oil works by soaking into the wood. If you put lacquer onto your drum the oil cannot soak in!

 

Gloss tung is a hard finish to get nice.

 

WET OIL

 

I would think if you are using Danish Oil (or any type of oil for that matter) that you should NOT use sanding sealer as you want the oil to absorb into the wood somewhat to seal it.

 

Danish Oil, Maloof, slow drying stuff, is the "sand into the wood while wet" stuff. NOT TUNG!!

To apply oil while wet: coat the shell, then dribble some on the paper. I wouldnt recommend this on a shell that has been dyed. if its dyed......

1. apply oil to shell, let it sit 5 minutes or so, wipe off. let dry for 24 hrs. do this 4 times, then on the 5th coat use 600 grit paper to sand. you are only trying to sand into the dried oil, not the dyed shell. be careful not to cut into the dye. I did this once and only once. that shell was then turned into ashes

This is typically what method most people use with Maloof oil. for regular tung oil, I'd just do a bunch of thin even coats. (a bunch meaning 20 or so) give it a little sand after about 6-7 coats just to make sure its level. Vaughn did a shell like with tung that looked glassier than lacquer or urethane.

 

Wet oil - another opinion: Apply the oil to the wood, work it in a minute. put a few drops on the sand paper, sand the oil mixture into the wood. Let it sit a few minutes. wipe dry. Doesn't take too long. Just keep the oil moist (not running off). On the inside, I usually sand it like this at 280 one time. The next night, do it again with 320. DONE!

 

Wet oil - and another opinion: If it is a wood oil, you apply it, and while wet, sand that into the wood. Apply drops of oil to work it into a slurry. Let it sit about 5 minutes after you finish sanding. Then, whip it dry and let it dry 24 hours. Keep doing that. The sand paper should be 600 the first time, then 800 the next time, 1000, 1200 and finally 1500

 

The gunsmith suggested the danish oil-varathane mix and that is working well. Easy as hell to work with!

The mix is not exactly 50-50, I would say 45 oil, 55 Varathane with a few drops of Japanr drier.

This (picture) is only sanded in to 1000, thats it, no wax... I was going to leave it, but I would like to see the results to 2000 grit.

 

 

TOPCOATING OIL

 

Oil is very similar to lacquer in that you really need to let it cure before you get to shinnin' it. Whenever I use oil I apply the first coats over top before the previous one is 100% dry, then I let it cure - 24 weeks. Then I go over it with steel wool dipped in oil so it acts as a lubricant. You never get a high gloss lacquer shine, but you will get a nice sheen - and it's usually comensurate with your level of patience!

The last step should be to use a quality furniture paste wax and buff to a nice satin sheen with a soft cloth.

 

I take some 0000 steel wool and lemon oil on my oil finishes. That adds to the sheen. but you need the oil to dry first....I think I waited about a month on the Maloof oil!

 

 

SMOOTH MATTE FINISH WITH OIL:

 

You don't sand between coats of oil. You actually sand the oil wet (600 grit). This causes it to pick up some wood, which then gets forced into all the pores. Slow and labor intensive. Apply oil, dribble some on the sand paper, sand wet oil for about 20 to 30 minutes, dribbling on some drops as needed. After about 30 minutes, let it sit for just a few minutes, then, old-t-shirt or cheese cloth off the damp oil. Wait 24 hours and do it again. Each time, going finer on the sand paper until you are sanding wet oil at about 1200 to 1500 grit. Then matte wax.

 

Another method:

If you plan on staining or dying your drum, DO NOT sand in the oil. Take my word on this. The "Sand-In" method usually take about 6-8 coats. I dont generally sand the oil in for 30 minutes per coat either. Ray must have some super stamina. I go around the shell 2-3 times, let it sit for 10 minutes or so, then wipe the excess oil off the shell. You will notice that the oil will look a little dirty on the rag. Dont be alarmed, it's normal. This will give you the smoothest matte finish.

 

 

POLY VS OIL

 

Poly leaves a nice clear finish, while oil will yellow the color of the wood a bit and change over time

 

Poly will also yellow a bit

 

Oil will not as much yellow as it will darken. it makes the wood look very rich, especially vaneers, in my experience.

TO DEFINE FIGURING:

 

Oil will pop the grain and define the figuring.

Danish or even boiled linseed oil.

If you plan to do any type of fade with dye .... do it first, then oil.

 

Another method to define figuring:

Luthier refinishers recommend a dewaxed shellac coat {as a sealer and to bring out highlights of figured wood} and then doing lacquer.

 

An option to oil:

Target coatings are all water based and work quite well.

From their site ....

Quote:

The Oxford® Ultima-WR Clear Base (WR400xx) can be used as a "Danish-Oil" type finish, bringing out the natural color tones of domestic and exotic woods without the introduction of dyes or pigments. Again, due to the emulsified linseed oil backbone, the Clear Base will cure and age to a soft amber tone, identical to linseed oil in turpentine but without the flammability or combustibility issues inherent in the older blends.

I concur, one coat of the clear base stain followed by a couple coats of the blonde Oxford UltraSeal-WB Water-Based Shellac will pop the grain/figuring.

If you go with the clear base stain .... be sure to wipe off access and let it cure for at least 24 hours (more if you can wait) before proceeding with the shellac.

Target says you can topcoat after about 2 hours ..... I don't trust that. Not with the linseed oil backbone. I prefer to let it cure a good while.

The shellac, on the other hand, cures quite fast.

You can get a decent effect with just the shellac .... but I feel that the clear base stain really helps with the POP.

I also find that their sanding sealer EM8800 and USL do better when reduced 10% with distilled water and applied in light coats. If you go pilling on the products per coat .... you run a very strong risk of blushing the finish (trapping solvents in the film structure).

 

Ghelley's mahogany kit was sanded & rubbed with a finishing oil, about 10 coats in total, sanding with finer paper between each coat, last twocoats used 0000 grade wire wool insted of sanding.

 

 

 

 

HOW TO CREATE A GUIDE COAT:

 

Spray on the primer/surfacer. Let it dry. Laquer, about 15 minute is all it takes! Follow the instructions on the can. Then, dry sand at 280 or 320, maybe 400 if you have it fairly smooth. When it looks, under good lighting, that it is smooth, then take some Krylon or Duplicolor Black lacquer and just apply a quick dusting (guide coat) of paint. Let that dry. Then, when you sand, lightly, the High spots will vanish really quick (the black will almost wipe off). Lows and pits and pores, will still retain the black! This lets you "see" what is going on.

 

 

POLY VS LACQUER:

 

Most of us use lacquer because you don't need specialized respiration or spraying equipment/environment. That, and it's cheap.

 

I don't use lacquers because of the high amount of toxins in some of them (I don't have a respirator). I use water base poly for glosses, although it has a lot of different properties than lacquer.

 

Polyurethane is a bit easier to work with... dries faster, quicker results. Lacquer is a more tedious process but it dries harder and clearer than poly. It also stinks more.

 

Poly dries quickly and is more scratch resistant. I use a self leveling Nitro Cellulose Lacquer. That way as it dries, the orange peel effect smoothes out. Lacquer has to sit for a very long time to cure though.

 

 

POLY VS LACQUER VS OIL:

 

The oil seems to take more abuse and is easy to fix (wipe on or dab on some more!). Lacquer is a brittle top coat. It will chip. Poly is less chip prone.

 

 

LACQUER:

 

The way I sprayed has been lay 4 coats within an hour letting it sit for 24 hours then do it again.

 

I wetsanded all of the grits at once. I went 600, 800, 1000, 1500, and 2000, then rubbing compound, then scratch remover, then polish. All sequentially in the same day. That snare I did in my signature went from raw shell to completed snare in under a week. The big thing is building up coats, and with lacquer, they burn into each other. I sprayed several thin coats every hour or two, then let it harden for a couple days. After wetsanding through scratch remover, let it sit for at least a couple weeks to "cure" (it never fully cures). Then you can wax or polish it.

 

Q:Can you lacquer wood that has been treated with vaseline?

A:I've shot lacquer, enamal, urathanes.......nothing sticks over Petroleum Jelly

 

Spraying lacquer:

Use a filter with the compressor, so you dont get moisture in the compressed air. Water and Lacquer don't mix!

 

Trick is about sanding lacquer, you wind up removing half of it to get the orange peel out of it! You should, when you are ready to final sand it, wet sand. Then, polish. It should be high gloss then.

 

Q: I've gone through 2 cans of gloss lacquer on a 6x14 snare shell? Am I overdoing it? I consider 3 times around the drum with nice even spray as 1 coat. I say I get about 9 coats per can but I like to lay them on thick. So yeah 18 coats, its thick as hell.

 

A:Woody said he put 3 cans into the entire oJ kit.

 

A:You didn't overdo it. just don't need anymore. let it sit...seriously...for a month before you start sanding. that much lacquer is going to need to cure for a while. don't sweat it, I usually would shoot 2 cans on a snare shell and my finishes would look friggin spectacular if I must say so.

MATTE COATING:

 

A lot of woodworkers like to use gloss top coat and then use steel wool or some other method to create the matte finish. The reason being that the matte ones can sometimes get yellower over time. more so than the gloss ones.

 

 

POLISHING:

 

Don't wait too long to polish poly because it gets harder than lacquer. Lacquer is sooooo easy to polish. Poly is a bit stubborn sometimes especially if you're used to lacquer. Once you get it polished though, it will last. Lacquer always develops little tiny cracks through it with enough time.

 

Lacquer is not high gloss. It has to be rubbed out to get that deep gloss. To apply it, you put 3-4 coats on, let it dry over night, sand it, put 3-4 more on, let dry, sand. When you get it like you want it, then it has to dry down for a for a minimum of 10 days before you can buff. And lacquer never "cures". The solvents continue to evaporate and continuously shrink. That's why you may have seen an old set that the finish has cracked.

 

Urethane clears on the other hand - spray 2-4 coats, wet on wet, and walk away, 1-2 days later . . .DONE! It doesn't have to be buffed for appearance, but usually there will be a couple of specks of dust that has stuck to it, so you just lightly "nib" it, polish, and it's ready. Urethanes have a catalyst that is added so they actually cure. So they don't shrink and they are much more durable. They can also be flattened for a satin look as well.

 

 

THE SHRINKAGE ISSUE:

 

All I use is Activated Poly. Mostly, House of Kolor UC-35. Love IT!!!!!! No problems YET!!!! But I do have to say that Poly does shrink as it cures. Unless a coating is a 100% Solid content coating then there will be shrinkage. If you put a solvent into it, then that solvent is going to come out. With that process, you have shrinkage. How much just depends upon the solid content of the coating and how much extra solvent that you add. The more solvent put in, then the less solid content of the coating. By the way, an example of a 100% solid coating would be a Rhino Spray in Bed Liner. Cures in about 5 seconds.

 

Even with a 100% Solid, it will still shrink. The chemical reaction which causes it to 'Cure,' causes the paint to 'Pull together' molecularly. Its known as 'After shrinkage'. The shrinkage by evaporation is substance release.

 

I have to totaly disagree with that statement. 100% solids do not shrink during cure. They have NO solvents. If you apply 20 mils then it cures to 20 mils. I have delt with these coating for over ten years and they do not shrink. There is no release of substance. The compounds are Poly and Isosionate. Isosionate is the curing compound. These coatings spray with specialized equipment and the two compounds do not mix until they exit the gun at high pressure.

 

 

WAX ALTERNATIVE:

 

Forget wax go to

www.zainobros.com

They make an automotive polish thats out of this world

Easy to use - has an SPF 40.

it's a three part system

Z1 show car polish lock

Z2 show car polish for clear coat

Z6 gloss enhancher spray

 

It's a great product - I use it on my cars and drums

You use Z1 once a year. Z2 I use at least once a month (on my cars) and spray enhancer after every wash.

As for my drums I do Z1&2. Every once in a while I do Z2.

The more Z2 use the deeper the shine and the gloss enhancer very frequently.

Z1 & Z2 last a very long time you'll use Z6 more often as long as you keep them in a climate controlled area they last for ever extreme cold and heat (car trunk) kills the shelf life. I wouldnt use it on an oil finish.

[Nikifena]

Камиончетата на Frantone - как се правят

[Gregg]

Още един клип /този път по-подробно/ как се прави лампа:

 

http://dailymotion.alice.it/video/x3wrzo_f...mpe-triode_tech

 

 

Приятно гледане!

[Nikifena]

Малко от фабриката на Moog

/спешъл благодарности на synchu за линка/

[Evtim Djerekarov]

Прекрасен туториал за правене на акустична китара.

http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?p=r&...1701&page=1

Редактирано Февруари 27, 2008 от Evtim Djerekarov

[gpav]

How they make it ? - Guitar Amp Редактирано Март 16, 2008 от TheWhiteGhost

[Satan]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=BB5cZDRZirE <- мераклийска работа, Les Paul от-до

<- и за левичари (мини рендето кефи ...) Редактирано Март 20, 2008 от Satan

[Nikifena]

две филмчета от peterson tuners - показват какво има вътре

[Nikifena]

Малко от производството на Electro-Harmonix

[twisted into form]

Как се правят басовете и китарите "Spector"

[IsoMorPhiC]

Ето как са го правили най-големите в производството на електронни лампи - историческо видео на производствения процес в можеби най-известната фабрика на Mullard, а именно тази в Блекбърн. Пожелавам ви приятно гледане!

[Nikifena]

^ Жестоко!!!

Благодаря!